BlogEpi vs. Norepi for Cardiogenic Shock

Epi vs. Norepi for Cardiogenic Shock

3 Comments

    1. Hey Scott. Thanks for bringing this up. That is a great point that an elevated lactate is not at all unexpected for patients on an epi drip. They defined refractory shock as: "major cardiac dysfunction assessed according to echocardiography, elevated lactate level, and acute deterioration of organ function (e.g., oliguria, liver failure) despite the use of >1 mg/kg/min of epinephrine/norepinephrine or dobutamine >10 mg/kg/min and/or intra-aortic balloon support and sustained hypotension (SAP <90 mm Hg or MAP <65 mm Hg) despite adequate intravascular volume." When I went back and combed through the supplementary material, it looks like elevated lactate was the primary driver of "refractory shock" leading to early stopping of the study. So, epi may have been a confounder. I missed this in the original article, as it was only clear in the supplementary appendix. It seems there are some other concerns though with epi: increased HR, slower lactate clearance, lower pH, trend toward increased 7-day mortality, statistically significant increased of death/ECMO in the epi group at 7 days and nearly significant trend at 28 days. I really appreciate this real-time feedback and have added an addendum to the original post.

      1. you will definitely get increased HR, that is a feature not a bug. The lower pH is from the lactate, and the lactate is from aerobic glycolysis so non-important.

        i am no supporter of epi first. i use norepi, but we can’t really draw conclusions about this from this study.

        don’t trust a study group that puts lactate in their endpoints for an epi study.

        great work on resending an email to readers!! great stuff.

        s

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